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open source database already called Firebird. So we renamed it again. At that point, it was fairly popular though not nearly as popular as it is now so we wanted to keep the Fire part of the name. We just went through Fireanything names for a couple of months, and somebody came up with Firefox, which is actually the Chinese name for a red panda.
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Livingston: Were the Firefox developers all in different places Ross: When we first started doing it, we were all at Netscape. Then Dave left to
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go to Apple to work on Safari, and we had some other folks like Ben Goodger from New Zealand, Pierre Chanial from France, and Jan Varga from Slovakia come on board. I went back to Miami, and we continued to work together online. Joe and I still collaborate through IM on Parakey, even though we re about 20 minutes apart, because we re so used to that environment from Firefox. It s just so much faster to collaborate online than it is for him to drive down to me or me to drive up to him.
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Livingston: Were there any conflicts with Dave working at Apple Ross: Yes. They were also making a simple end-user browser, and he was not
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really supposed to be working on a competitor to that. It wasn t on our end that we had a problem.
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Livingston: Did he leave Apple Ross: No. He still works on Safari right now. He did Firefox and then went off
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to Apple.
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Livingston: So then it was just a few of you. Ross: The Firefox team is always changing. It s not fair to say there are just a
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few of us, because we re based on Mozilla, which obviously has dozens of developers, and there are a lot of developers working on Gecko, the core layout engine. The Firefox team itself the people worrying about everything wrapped around the engine and working on the separate fork of the code base was always about four or five different people for the first year. Now there are a lot more, obviously, because it s the main source tree. All those people that were working on Mozilla now work on Firefox.
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Livingston: What was the first turning point when you knew you were really
onto something
Ross: I think it was when we put out our first milestone, which wasn t even . . .
We put it on an FTP site and had an article on mozillaZine, which is a community news site. It was already getting as many downloads as a Mozilla milestone. On the one side, you had a lot of Mozilla people the hardcore developer types who didn t like what we were doing, because focusing on mom and dad is heretical in much of the open source world. Then there were a lot of people who were saying, Finally, Mozilla is stepping away from its geek roots and doing something more mainstream. We got a lot of coverage early on from bloggers and PC World and stuff like that. It got out of control pretty quickly.
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Livingston: Did you have problems getting users at the beginning Ross: No, but the users we were getting weren t really the target audience;
these were people that downloaded beta builds from Mozilla. So it was still a geek audience. We had to transform the culture at Mozilla because it was all based around open source ethos, which says programmers are kings, marketers are sleaze, and everyone else can read the manual. All the branding for Mozilla looked very Communist the logo was a dinosaur and the banners ads were . . . I can t even describe it, but very odd, technical kind of imagery that didn t appeal to most people. We had to move a lot of that into a more mainstream world.
Livingston: How did you do that Ross: The first thing that happened was that Netscape split off Mozilla into an
independent entity. Mozilla was once just the open source technology arm of Netscape they made technology and Netscape distributed it. When Netscape said goodbye, Mozilla didn t really have any kind of major distributor anymore. As Firefox matured, Mozilla decided that they could try to distribute it directly to the user without having to go through a middleman like Netscape. At that point, the culture started to shift out of necessity; the organization had to cater to more users or potentially collapse.
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