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Livingston: What were the first things you did after Steve suggested starting a
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company You were still working at HP, right
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Wozniak: The very first thought in my mind was, I think I signed a document that everything I design belongs to Hewlett-Packard. Even just on my own time, I thought that they deserved it first. And I wanted Hewlett-Packard to build this. I loved my division. I was going to work there for life. It was the calculator division; it was the right division to move into this kind of a computer. I went to management, and I had three levels of bosses above me in a room and a couple of other engineers, and I presented the ideas and told them what we could do at what price and how it would work. They were intrigued by it, but they couldn t justify it as a Hewlett-Packard product for some good reasons. Hewlett-Packard couldn t do a simple project, which was really what was interesting. They had to do a real finished-for-scientists type of computer that would be too expensive and really wouldn t start the mass movement. They were a little concerned about using a TV set that didn t come from Hewlett-Packard. When there s a problem, how do you decide where the solution is But I know they were intrigued by it quite a bit. That was when we were going to sell PC boards for $40 each. When Steve called me one day at work and he said he got an order for $50,000 100 built computer boards for $500 each that was high money. That was twice my annual salary at Hewlett-Packard. So then I got HewlettPackard s legal department to search every division I wrote down what we were doing and had them search every division but the thing is that the calculator division was the lowest one in Hewlett-Packard. The others wouldn t want to touch anything cheap. It was too cheap for our division, and the other ones wouldn t touch it even more. So I got a written response back from them that no divisions were interested. Now it was almost like we were big-time. We were going to sell some computers. Sure, we only sold 150 (maybe less) of the Apple Is, but it was a real computer and we had our name in all the magazines with charts and comparisons. This whole industry s springing up and there are articles about it. And no article could skip a company with a name like Apple. Livingston: How d you come up with Apple Wozniak: Steve came up with it. I do remember that one. I picked him up at the San Francisco airport and I was driving down the Bay on 101 and then on 85, and it was on 85 that he said, Oh, I ve got a name for the company. Apple Computer. Both of us were sitting there trying to come up with techie names that were clever, but nothing was going to be better than Apple. And I said, But what about Apple Records (Which is funny because we re still having problems with them.) And he said, They re a different company.
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So we said, OK, we ll do Apple Computer. In those days there was no money yet in this microcomputer business, and big experienced companies and investors, analysts those kind of people, that are trained in business and much smarter than we were they didn t think that this was going to be a real big market. They thought it was going to be a little hobby thing, like home robots or ham radios, that a few techie people would get into and really it wasn t going to go to the masses. In the Homebrew Computer Club, we felt it was going to affect every home in the country. But we felt it for the wrong reasons. We felt that everybody was technical enough to really use it and write their own programs and solve their problems that way. Even when we started Apple, we had very mistaken ideas about where the market was going to be that big. We didn t foresee the VisiCalc spreadsheet.
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Livingston: Had you quit Hewlett-Packard Wozniak: That was very tough. We started selling the Apple Is, and I stayed at Hewlett-Packard. I still intended to be at that company forever. Our calculator division moved up to Corvallis, Oregon, and my wife didn t want to move to Corvallis and I did, so that was lucky because otherwise I would have been up in Oregon and Apple never would have happened. So I stayed here and I moved into another division of Hewlett-Packard across the street that made the Hewlett-Packard 3000 minicomputers. I was working there for a while getting educated on the HP 3000 . . . for the Apple II, we knew it was so good . . . that was a product that broke ground in every which way. The Apple I, oddly enough, was probably more important, because it said that a computer of the future is going to have a keyboard and a video display and it s going to look like a typewriter. It s going to be roughly that size. And it s funny, but every computer since the Apple I, including the Polymorphics technology Sol computer that came next (it was out of our club), had a keyboard and a video display. No computer had done this before that. No small computer was coming with a keyboard yet. The Apple I was the first and the Apple II was the third. Basically every computer since then had a keyboard and a video display. The world has never gone back from that day. Now the Apple II was the great design. I designed it very efficiently with very few parts amazing design. We added color. How could you ever have color and still cut the chips in half It was half the chips of an Apple I. It had color, and it was just a clever idea that popped in my head one late night at Atari. When you get very, very tired and I had been up four nights all night long; Steve and I got mononucleosis your head gets in this real creative state and it thinks of ideas that you d normally just throw out. I came up with this idea of taking one little cheap (less than $1) part with 4 bits in it. If I spun it around at the right rate, the data that comes out of that chip looks like color TV. And I could put 16 different patterns and they all look like different colors, sort of. Would a digital signal that goes up and down actually work on a color TV the way there are sine waves and complicated calculus to develop how color TV was established in the television world Would it work
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