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Ken Thompson part of debugging. It s not complete when you first write something. You extend it. Seibel: Once you ve built a system, do you go back and document it in any way Thompson: It depends on what it s for. If it s for me, no I won t. I ll put in a usage line if I forget the arguments. And I ll put in a comment at the header about what the whole thing does. But very, very brief. If it s part of a system or a library or something that s meant to be published, then I ll take the time to document it. But otherwise, no. Documenting is an art as fine as programming. It s rare I find documentation at the level I like. Usually it s much, much finer-grained than need be. It contains a bunch of irrelevancies and dangling references that assume knowledge not there. Documenting is very, very hard; it s time-consuming. To do it right, you ve got to do it like programming. You ve got to deconstruct it, put it together in nice ways, rewrite it when it s wrong. People don t do that. Also, I prefer bottom-up documentation and that s usually not the way it s written. If some program relies on other programs or files or data structures, I like to see clear a reference to those where I can go off and read those and they don t refer back. Seibel: So you d like to understand code the way you would like to write it, which is from the bottom up Thompson: Yeah. It s the way I can put a handle on it in my mind and remember. Otherwise I read it and I may understand it right after I read it but then it s gone. If I understand the structure of it, then it s part of me and I ll understand it. Seibel: In your Turing Award talk you mentioned that if Dan Bobrow had been forced to use a PDP-11 instead of the more powerful PDP-10 he might have been receiving the award that day instead of you and Dennis Ritchie. Thompson: I was just trying to say it was serendipitous.
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Ken Thompson Seibel: Do you think you benefited to being constrained by the less powerful machine Thompson: There was certainly a benefit that it was small and efficient. But I think that was the kind of code we wrote anyway. But it was more the fact that it was right at the cusp of a revolution of minicomputers. The 10 was the big mainframe run by the computer center. Computing going autonomous instead of centralized was, I think, the really serendipitous part of it. And that rode in on the PDP-11. Seibel: Didn t Unix also benefit from being written in C while OSs like TENEX and ITS were written in assembly and couldn t jump to different hardware as easily as Unix Thompson: There were good system-programming languages that things were written in to some extent. Seibel: Such as Thompson: NELIAC was a system-programming version of Algol 58. Seibel: Was Bliss also from that era Thompson: Bliss I think was after. And their emphasis was trying to compile well. I think it was pretty clear from the beginning that you shouldn t kill yourself compiling well. You should do well but not really good. And the reason is that in the time it takes you to go from well to really good, Moore s law has already surpassed you. You can pick up 10 percent but while you re picking up that 10 percent, computers have gotten twice as fast and maybe with some other stuff that matters more for optimization, like caches. I think it s largely a waste of time to do really well. It s really hard; you generate as many bugs as you fix. You should stop, not take that extra 100 percent of time to do 10 percent of the work. Seibel: You ve presumably heard of the essay, Worse Is Better by Richard Gabriel. Thompson: No.
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