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Livingston: You joined another startup Newmark: Remember, in the conventional sense, we were never a startup. In the conventional sense, a startup is a company, maybe with great ideas, that becomes a serious corporation. It usually takes serious investment, has a strategy, and they want to make a lot of money. We ve done something very different. I ve stepped away from a huge amount of money, and I m following through. In 99, we made this real. I did make some more mistakes, but by 2000, with Jim handling a lot of stuff, we ve made only the occasional mistake since. Livingston: Will you tell me about some of those mistakes Newmark: Actually, there are legal settlements which prevent me from talking about a lot of them. I can answer specific questions, sometimes. Livingston: Did a mistake have to do with personnel Newmark: Yes. And I didn t listen to lawyers well enough. And those two issues
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Livingston: So you had some personnel issues that involved lawsuits, but then
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you were able to get some closure Then you hired Jim
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Newmark: No, Jim helped lead us out of the difficulties. I m being vague, but
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Livingston: Going back to the time when you were still in your apartment, was there anything that worried you Newmark: I can t think of anything. I may be forgetting a lot, but I think the only worry I can recall was that, when you run your server on someone else s machine, if there s a problem in the middle of the night, you have an issue. Or, if you are running it at a service, and they are flaky and have weak customer service, that s another problem. Livingston: Did your site ever go down Newmark: I think it did, but in a way that s reasonable and understandable. Once in a while, our site has problems this way, but the thing is that we still manage to keep it up pretty well and keep it fast, which is hard because we re in another surge of growth. We re now getting at least five billion page views a month. We re in 170 cities. Livingston: Back to how you got people to help you with this. Did people come
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Newmark: Well, how can they help me run the site We spoke about making it a nonprofit and that made some sense, given my ignorance then. Now I realize there s a lot of legal constraints in nonprofits. They re meant to prevent various forms of corruption. The thing is, like a lot of laws like that, people who are crooked always find ways around the laws, and so the constraints just make it more difficult for the honest people. We are very, very lucky we re not a nonprofit. We have our own nonprofit, which is doing some really good things. I m on the board there, but my gig is customer service. Livingston: When you first started, did you worry about spammers and other people trying to take advantage of your site Newmark: We have a really good culture of trust on the site of goodwill. You know, we re finding that pretty much everyone out there shares, more or less, the same moral compass as we do and as my personal one. People are good. There are some bad guys out there, but they are a very tiny minority and our community is self-policing. People want other people to play fair, and that works. That does mean a certain amount of our time, including mine, but that s OK. Livingston: You set up a way for the community to regulate the site, right Newmark: Yes: flagging. Flagging works. By virtue of flagging, we ve turned
over control of our site, for the most part, on a day-to-day basis to the people who use the site. We need to figure out better ways of doing that; that s still in process.
Livingston: How did you first come up with the idea of flagging Newmark: I forget. I think it was my customer service team, not me. I don t recall, it was so long ago. Livingston: But it worked pretty well
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